We're watching the West Wing. Mathgimp (who would be referred to as "I" if nuraido wasn't posting this) stopped the episode for the past 20 minutes so we can Google whether the following claim is accurate: "It is unlawful for a citizen to sue a sitting president." Please, for the love of the Constitution, can someone answer this question so that we can resume mindless tv watching?
Love
HON
ps: mathgimp's contention is that there is nothing in the constitution itself that directly precludes a civil suit against the president. If there exists a SC decision saying it's precluded, that's different, and I'm still right. hahahahaha.
pps: nuraido doesn't actually care, hates law school, and just wants to watch TV and go to bed. hahahahahhaha.
West Wing claimed it, not I, says the turtle.
Update: nuraido needs to explain to me (mathgimp) how GM food will extinct humans. A couple of notes: I think GM food is likely to be risky, particularly considering the farming system and lack of oversight in the US. Extinction is, however, a very strong word. Second, she wanted this reminder in this post, so I'm not being a jerk. Really.
Monday, September 10, 2007
Can you sue the president?
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8 comments:
You are all wrong because we don't have a constitution anymore. I don't know, talk to John Yoo and David Addington.
Plus, I refuse to lend my three-week old law school expertise to these shenanigans on the basis that nuraido has asked for our law school expertise and also maligned our chosen educational vocation. Pbbbbbt.
sarah wants to know if "you're still communing with gravity, because none of that makes any sense."
I suppose my first question would be: are you suing the President as the President, or as a private citizen?
If it's as the President, then I think you'd first have to state a federal claim. If you've got federal jurisdiction, then it seems like the President isn't usually the party named in the suit. From what I've seen, it's probably either the AG or the Solicitor General. Usually, the office of the President has counsel, so you'd have to go through that office. Of course, I'm totally talking out of turn here and I can't really know.
But if your dream is to name our Commander-in-Chief in a lawsuit, you'll probably have better luck randomly suing a guy with the same name...
Again, I claim no expertise or knowledge in this matter. However, I can now talk at length about partnerships and profit sharing, should anyone be interested.
But the president is a private citizen. I'm not trying to sue the office of head of the executive branch. I'm trying to sue him as an individual, but while he is a sitting president.
For example, suppose I decide that Bush harmed me in some way when I lived in Texas, and file a lawsuit. To draw a parallel to what we were talking about tonight, suppose I believed that he was in some way personally responsible for a negligent homicide that occurred in Houston, that I could sue for. Texas courts, I would assume, have jurisdiction over that case, regardless of Bush's job. The question is whether or not the constitution protects him from such an action.
Because he is still a citizen (I'm fairly certain this is true), and because Texas law has jurisdiction over the case that I mentioned (I think this is true, but I'm far from a law student), it seems that there would have to be something in the constitution that expressly forbids the suit in order for it to be quashed out of hand. I'm just wondering if such a provision exists.
(By the way, anonymous, are you new to the blog, or do I know you in real life. If not, welcome! If you're Shween, FACE!!!!!)
A learned (but apparently shy) friend of mine sent me his two cents:
The answer is that the president canNOT be sued while President for actions taken in his official capacity (Nixon v. Fitzgerald). A sitting president can, however, be sued for unofficial actions (Jones v. Clinton). So you can't sue the President for his decision to commit troops to an illegal foreign war, but you can sue the President for grabbing your ass.
So it turns out a citizen can, in fact, sue a sitting president.
See Paula Jones v. Bill Clinton (just google it and you will find the legalese.)
oops, Smed beat me to the punch.
I second her comment.
I have one question to ask the individual that would sue the president... Will you marry me?
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